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	<title>Comments on: Debt Repayment 101: A Perfect Candidate For The Ol&#8217; Debt Snowball</title>
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	<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/</link>
	<description>Simple, applicable personal finance advice for the modern world</description>
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		<title>By: Queercents &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Surviving Financial Infidelity: Cleaning Up the Mess</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/comment-page-1/#comment-430765</link>
		<dc:creator>Queercents &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Surviving Financial Infidelity: Cleaning Up the Mess</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Dec 2008 03:23:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/#comment-430765</guid>
		<description>[...] a Payment Plan There are many ways to pay off debt. Whether you use the debt snowball technique, or a multi-pronged approach to paying off credit cards, it boils down to creating a budget, and [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] a Payment Plan There are many ways to pay off debt. Whether you use the debt snowball technique, or a multi-pronged approach to paying off credit cards, it boils down to creating a budget, and [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Troy</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/comment-page-1/#comment-302183</link>
		<dc:creator>Troy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 21:27:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/#comment-302183</guid>
		<description>Tough crowd.

I would disregard both calculating MTR and considering MTR in debt repayment.

Too many assumptions about tax brackets, itemization, etc.

Keep things simple.  DR snowball method works best.  Lowest balance to highest balance.  Keeps the incentive to pay it all off the fastest.  

The faster you pay off the debt (which is controlled by emotion) the less the interest rates on that debt matter.

Dave knows</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tough crowd.</p>
<p>I would disregard both calculating MTR and considering MTR in debt repayment.</p>
<p>Too many assumptions about tax brackets, itemization, etc.</p>
<p>Keep things simple.  DR snowball method works best.  Lowest balance to highest balance.  Keeps the incentive to pay it all off the fastest.  </p>
<p>The faster you pay off the debt (which is controlled by emotion) the less the interest rates on that debt matter.</p>
<p>Dave knows</p>
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		<title>By: Make Friends, Earn Money</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/comment-page-1/#comment-210367</link>
		<dc:creator>Make Friends, Earn Money</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Mar 2008 11:31:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/#comment-210367</guid>
		<description>I think that ranking them by interest rate is a much better option as even a lower debt with a higher interest rate can cost more.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that ranking them by interest rate is a much better option as even a lower debt with a higher interest rate can cost more.</p>
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		<title>By: Ha'apai</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/comment-page-1/#comment-49455</link>
		<dc:creator>Ha'apai</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Jul 2007 23:00:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/#comment-49455</guid>
		<description>I agree, showing folks how to get effective rates of interest out of stated rates is extremely valuable.  

Please continue showing folks how to translate stated rates of interest into effective rates.  We all should have been taught how to do this in high school -- first in Algebra 1 and a second time in the first year of calculus, preferrably just after that horrible proof (theta and the word &quot;marginal&quot; come to mind but the rest is a blur) almost soured us on math forever.  1-mtr has the capacity to cut through an enormous amount of confusion and salesmanship.  The world would definitely be a better place if more of us reflexively applied the formula to any tax-favored idea dangled in front of us.  

And please be careful.  1-mtr is a beautiful thing and you have stumbled over the most basic steps and sullied her.  Her really devious tricks come into play when tax brackets are straddled, phase-outs apply, or when there are limits on the amount that can be deducted or the size of credits, none of which appear to apply here.  You should not be stumbling over such elementary things as the deductibility of second mortgages and HELOCs and the income-sensitive nature of the student loan interest deduction.  

We&#039;ve come to expect better.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree, showing folks how to get effective rates of interest out of stated rates is extremely valuable.  </p>
<p>Please continue showing folks how to translate stated rates of interest into effective rates.  We all should have been taught how to do this in high school &#8212; first in Algebra 1 and a second time in the first year of calculus, preferrably just after that horrible proof (theta and the word &#8220;marginal&#8221; come to mind but the rest is a blur) almost soured us on math forever.  1-mtr has the capacity to cut through an enormous amount of confusion and salesmanship.  The world would definitely be a better place if more of us reflexively applied the formula to any tax-favored idea dangled in front of us.  </p>
<p>And please be careful.  1-mtr is a beautiful thing and you have stumbled over the most basic steps and sullied her.  Her really devious tricks come into play when tax brackets are straddled, phase-outs apply, or when there are limits on the amount that can be deducted or the size of credits, none of which appear to apply here.  You should not be stumbling over such elementary things as the deductibility of second mortgages and HELOCs and the income-sensitive nature of the student loan interest deduction.  </p>
<p>We&#8217;ve come to expect better.</p>
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		<title>By: Trent</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/comment-page-1/#comment-49301</link>
		<dc:creator>Trent</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Jul 2007 13:37:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/#comment-49301</guid>
		<description>Ha&#039;apai: I used a hypothetical interest rate so the effect would be clear.  I don&#039;t know what his interest rate is and what&#039;s deductible for him - I just wanted to show how to do the calculation and why it&#039;s important.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ha&#8217;apai: I used a hypothetical interest rate so the effect would be clear.  I don&#8217;t know what his interest rate is and what&#8217;s deductible for him &#8211; I just wanted to show how to do the calculation and why it&#8217;s important.</p>
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		<title>By: Trent</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/comment-page-1/#comment-49300</link>
		<dc:creator>Trent</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Jul 2007 13:35:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/#comment-49300</guid>
		<description>Mike: this is a true worst-case scenario for Dave&#039;s psychology-based snowball because the largest loan is also the highest-interest loan.  You would be throwing a lot of money away doing it that way.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mike: this is a true worst-case scenario for Dave&#8217;s psychology-based snowball because the largest loan is also the highest-interest loan.  You would be throwing a lot of money away doing it that way.</p>
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		<title>By: Trent</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/comment-page-1/#comment-49299</link>
		<dc:creator>Trent</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Jul 2007 13:33:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/#comment-49299</guid>
		<description>I did not make the assumption that the HELOC was tax-deductible for a number of reasons, the biggest one being that it makes no difference whether it&#039;s deductible or not, it&#039;s still the highest-interest loan (even after figuring in deduction).  He gave no information about his actual mortgage.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I did not make the assumption that the HELOC was tax-deductible for a number of reasons, the biggest one being that it makes no difference whether it&#8217;s deductible or not, it&#8217;s still the highest-interest loan (even after figuring in deduction).  He gave no information about his actual mortgage.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/comment-page-1/#comment-49242</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Jul 2007 06:38:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/#comment-49242</guid>
		<description>Also, since you described this as &quot;Dave Ramsey&#039;s&quot; debt snowball, I&#039;d point out that Dave would put the home equity loan last in the snowball, regardless of the interest rate or deductibility.  He recommends ordering the debts from smallest to largest, and the home equity loan is the largest.

His rationale isn&#039;t based on the mathematics--it&#039;s based on what happens to people emotionally.  As you pay off debts, you get to scratch off the small ones more quickly, and start seeing debt balances go down by larger amounts sooner.  These faster &quot;attaboy&quot;&#039;s are encouraging and helps you see the progress you&#039;re making, and raises your chances of becoming debt free.

Contrast that with paying off the largest, highest interest rate debt first--you see it go down but it seems S-L-O-W.  Since you&#039;re still making minimum payments on all the debts, your extra payment on the larger one is smaller than if you knocked them out smallest to largerst.  The higher interest rate makes it seem like you&#039;re gaining very little ground as you try to chip away at it--you take some away, and the interest puts some back, and again it&#039;s the largest debt so it seems like you&#039;re losing the most ground.  

This makes the &quot;finish line&quot; seem very far away, and makes the pile of debt seem much larger.  It&#039;s much easier in that scenario to get discouraged and give up, even if mathematically you&#039;re making better progress by paying off a higher interest rate debt.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Also, since you described this as &#8220;Dave Ramsey&#8217;s&#8221; debt snowball, I&#8217;d point out that Dave would put the home equity loan last in the snowball, regardless of the interest rate or deductibility.  He recommends ordering the debts from smallest to largest, and the home equity loan is the largest.</p>
<p>His rationale isn&#8217;t based on the mathematics&#8211;it&#8217;s based on what happens to people emotionally.  As you pay off debts, you get to scratch off the small ones more quickly, and start seeing debt balances go down by larger amounts sooner.  These faster &#8220;attaboy&#8221;&#8217;s are encouraging and helps you see the progress you&#8217;re making, and raises your chances of becoming debt free.</p>
<p>Contrast that with paying off the largest, highest interest rate debt first&#8211;you see it go down but it seems S-L-O-W.  Since you&#8217;re still making minimum payments on all the debts, your extra payment on the larger one is smaller than if you knocked them out smallest to largerst.  The higher interest rate makes it seem like you&#8217;re gaining very little ground as you try to chip away at it&#8211;you take some away, and the interest puts some back, and again it&#8217;s the largest debt so it seems like you&#8217;re losing the most ground.  </p>
<p>This makes the &#8220;finish line&#8221; seem very far away, and makes the pile of debt seem much larger.  It&#8217;s much easier in that scenario to get discouraged and give up, even if mathematically you&#8217;re making better progress by paying off a higher interest rate debt.</p>
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		<title>By: Ha'apai</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/comment-page-1/#comment-49239</link>
		<dc:creator>Ha'apai</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Jul 2007 06:14:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/#comment-49239</guid>
		<description>Ouch!  The impulse to calculate effective interest rates is commendible but the application has been remarkably sloppy.  

I&#039;m a huge fan of 1-mtr.  It&#039;s simple and it cuts through an amazing amount of deduction-worship.  Unfortunately, you have to understand a thing or two about the tax code in order to use it.  The HELOC is probably deductible.  The 28% bracket and student loan interest combo is impossible.  You start losing the student loan interest deduction long before you reach that bracket.  There are also state and local taxes to consider with the student loan interest deduction and the return from a savings account.  

Bad day, eh?  We all have those.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ouch!  The impulse to calculate effective interest rates is commendible but the application has been remarkably sloppy.  </p>
<p>I&#8217;m a huge fan of 1-mtr.  It&#8217;s simple and it cuts through an amazing amount of deduction-worship.  Unfortunately, you have to understand a thing or two about the tax code in order to use it.  The HELOC is probably deductible.  The 28% bracket and student loan interest combo is impossible.  You start losing the student loan interest deduction long before you reach that bracket.  There are also state and local taxes to consider with the student loan interest deduction and the return from a savings account.  </p>
<p>Bad day, eh?  We all have those.</p>
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		<title>By: MikeVx</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/comment-page-1/#comment-49230</link>
		<dc:creator>MikeVx</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Jul 2007 04:33:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/#comment-49230</guid>
		<description>Er...Trent, you are not recommending the debt snowball, you are recommending the opposite.  Ranking by interest rate is the mathematically best option, but that fails for so many people because of how long it takes to perceive making a dent in the highest-interest debt, which is often the highest-balance.  The whole point of the debt snowball is to trade the money in extra interest for the psychological boost you get from collapsing the debts more frequently by picking off the small debts first.

The emergency fund is a good idea regardless of the payoff tactics used.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Er&#8230;Trent, you are not recommending the debt snowball, you are recommending the opposite.  Ranking by interest rate is the mathematically best option, but that fails for so many people because of how long it takes to perceive making a dent in the highest-interest debt, which is often the highest-balance.  The whole point of the debt snowball is to trade the money in extra interest for the psychological boost you get from collapsing the debts more frequently by picking off the small debts first.</p>
<p>The emergency fund is a good idea regardless of the payoff tactics used.</p>
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		<title>By: Toby</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/comment-page-1/#comment-49215</link>
		<dc:creator>Toby</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Jul 2007 02:46:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/#comment-49215</guid>
		<description>The HELOC interest is almost certainly tax-deductible.  
I believe the limit is interest on the first 100k of a HEL OR HELOC is deductible, unless you&#039;ve left out some detail about Brad&#039;s finances that would make that interest ineligible for a deduction.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The HELOC interest is almost certainly tax-deductible.<br />
I believe the limit is interest on the first 100k of a HEL OR HELOC is deductible, unless you&#8217;ve left out some detail about Brad&#8217;s finances that would make that interest ineligible for a deduction.</p>
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		<title>By: Kevin</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/comment-page-1/#comment-49213</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Jul 2007 02:42:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/#comment-49213</guid>
		<description>Generally isn&#039;t the interest on most HELOC&#039;s tax deductable?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Generally isn&#8217;t the interest on most HELOC&#8217;s tax deductable?</p>
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		<title>By: NCReader</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/comment-page-1/#comment-49172</link>
		<dc:creator>NCReader</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Jul 2007 21:25:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/07/22/debt-repayment-101-a-perfect-candidate-for-the-ol-debt-snowball/#comment-49172</guid>
		<description>I thought interest from a home equity line of credit was tax deductible if the total of your mortgage plus the home equity line of credit amount did not exceed the fair market value of your home.  In that case, doesn&#039;t the IRS treat interest on debt secured by your home as &quot;mortgage&quot; interest even if it&#039;s in the form of a HELOC?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I thought interest from a home equity line of credit was tax deductible if the total of your mortgage plus the home equity line of credit amount did not exceed the fair market value of your home.  In that case, doesn&#8217;t the IRS treat interest on debt secured by your home as &#8220;mortgage&#8221; interest even if it&#8217;s in the form of a HELOC?</p>
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