In the end walmart and target, to me, are not even competitors because of this disparity.

it’d be like trying to peg fry’s electronics as a competitor to bestbuy, again there is about a 20-1 disparity in best buys to fry’s and despite having a basically similar stock they don’t feel like competitors.

No matter how well designed a marketing campaign is, it cannot take an extremely negative perception (such as those that many people have associated with Wal-marts) and instantly turn it positive. What it can do (and often does far too successfully) is slightly adjust that perception in the direction the advertiser wishes. Upwards in the case of a store advertising to you, downwards if it’s a political attack ad, etc.

If Wal-mart or Target or any store ran an ad that simply said “Buy our junk because we said so”, it would mostly be rediculed and ignored, because the ad would be attempting to overtly change something that people generally resist changing, namely their perceptions of a given product or store.

And yet, that same message of “But our junk because we said so” is really at the heart of all advertising. The true power of ads comes in subtle, gradual changes. The advertisers try to build associations of one sort or another, associations that will alter our overall buying patterns given enough time. They try to build an image that given product or store is “better”, often for reasons that really make little sense if you tried to analyze them. Is Mr. Clean more effective at the job of cleaning because a cartoon character on the bottle winks at you? Is Pine-sol really more effective at cleaning because it leaves a residue that smells like the sap of a tree that many people only encounter at Christmas?

But make no mistake, advertisers are very successful at their jobs. If you go to someone and say “How about getting a burger for lunch?” the first thing most people will think of is one of several fast-food restaurants that specialise in burgers (McDonald’s, Wendy’s, Burger King, roy Rogers, etc.) A few might think of a more upscale restaurant like Uno’s or Fuddrucker’s. I suspct that only a small handful will stop and think of a pack of frozen beef patties already in their freezer, ready to be tossed on the stove at a moments notice. This is despite the fact that those burgers can be just as good, prepared just as fast, and are usually less expensive than the ones most restaurants serve.

While I doubt that marketing is the sole reason for this phenomenon, I am sure that it has a lot to do with the association that leads to that first thought. And often it is the first thought that pops into our minds that sets the parameters for our final choice on what to buy and where to buy it.

But that is marketing – 100% marketing. Target is simply better at marketing. If you don’t think so, you’re fooling yourself and falling into the trap. Let me explain.

There are more WalMarts in America than Targets. That’s because there are a lot of WalMarts in towns without Targets, but not vice-versa.

In towns without competition, the owner of the WalMart doesn’t have to worry about marketing himself well – it’s the only shop in town. Why spend big money on cleaning? Do the minimum and that’s good enough.

In towns with competition, both stores have to raise their game, and they do. They need to market themselves well to their shoppers or else their shoppers will go down the street to the competitor.

Now, if you visit a random Wal-Mart, it *is* likely to be dirtier than the average Target because of the competition factor described above. If I’m used to the cleanliness and presentation of WalMarts and Targets in towns with competitions and then visit a non-competition WalMart, I’m going to be repulsed, get a bad image of WalMart in my head, and avoid it in a large town where I can easily go to a Target.

That’s all marketing, and it’s something WalMart doesn’t do well. They don’t use their marketing dollars to crack down on the unclean branches in smaller towns, and those do a lot to contribute to the “unclean” WalMart meme.

Now, when people go to a town with a WalMart and a Target, they’ll often choose the Target because it’s cleaner, even though that’s not necessarily the case.

It’s all in the marketing.

If WalMart wanted to turn that around, they’d put some serious weight on individual WalMarts to clean up their act. They’d institute a program where shoppers could report uncleanliness, and they’d reward branches in small towns that met thresholds of cleanliness reporting. They’d offer “cleanliness guarantees” to customers, saying things like “If you visit a Wal-Mart and aren’t completely satisfied with the cleanliness of the visit, show what you don’t like to the manager and you’ll receive a $5 off coupon for your next visit.” THAT’S how WalMart could use marketing to turn this around.

I agree with your larger point about advertising, and also your point that as corporate citizens target & walmart are almost equally (ir-)responsible.

But I gotta call shenanigans on the cleanliness factor. I’ve been to dozens of both stores in various parts of the country. It’s true you can find a Target dirtier than the cleanest Walmarts. But there is no Target I’ve run into even remotely as skanky (& cluttered & crowded & poorly lit) as the average (non-Super) Walmart. Now this probably has a lot to do with location & clientèle. but it also has much to do with corporate emphases.

this then further interacts with their advertising. but it’s not as simple as either one lying about their strengths. no, they take their brands’ strengths, plus perceived strengths, and bolster them with advertising.

Here is what I know: Target does know offer health insurance to their part-time employees. You have 6 months plus a ton of hours to be eligible.

My husband worked for Target for 2 years. Before he started, I was a Target shopper and he was a Wal-Mart shopper. When he started working there, he became a Target shopper and I switched to Wal-Mart. I was so sick of all of the garbage that I had to listen to when he came home. We are better than Wal-Mart this, we are better than Wal-mart that. So, we visited 8 Wal-Marts and 8 Targets in three states (we were going on vacation). Our Wal-Mart by our house is cleaner (I was suprised and thrilled). Most of the Wal-Marts and Targets were about the same. I see NO distiction. Each store should be individually chosen.

As a side note to Trent – I started making my own bread and it is glorious. I borrowed my mother’s bread machine, but still no extra cost to me.

As for the Wal-Mart versus Target debate, I think they’re both equally despicable. Oh, the shopping experience is comfortable enough. The Wal-Marts in my area are rearranging their merchandise and putting in nice wood floors in the clothing section. There’s the smell of McDonald’s fries and Wal-Mart deli fried chicken wafting through the store. The produce is bright and yummy looking. The bathrooms are cleaned, it seems, every hour. They, too, are carrying some of the nicer furniture in the latest styles.

The Target store is the same as Wal-Mart, only with the smell of Starbucks and soft pretzels wafting through the store. I must admit their little girls’ clothes (I have three girls) are less revealing and trashy looking than Wal-Mart’s Mary Kate and Ashley brand, but I tend to associate that with the brand rather than Wal-Mart itself.

With all of that pleasant atmosphere it’s almost possible to forget some of the unfair things they do to employees. In fact, one of our neighbors works at Wal-Mart and I have posted here before about how wasteful he told me they are. I have no doubt that Target is the same way. However, if we boycotted every company that did it’s employees dirty these days, we’d all be growing our own food, weaving our own cloth, making our own clothing, and basically living like pioneers.

Oooo, good point Kate. My parents did a lot of this when we were kids so I think that helped us a lot.

I despise Walmart and will not buy from Target after reading this article. I’m so glad that injured employee will get to keep her $. My area just recently squashed Walmart from putting a store here and the rest of NYC is doing the same.

I prefer to shop at stores where I feel like I’m getting good quality and the staff is probably being treated fairly. I may pay a little more, but in the long run it may be costing me much less. (longer wearing, employess might not end up unemployed, on welfare, food stamps, etc.)

Plus, I just feel better about it. I’m also going to do some research to try to find more products that are made in the USA.

Nutritional issues aside, I’m guessing that most ten-year-olds who are required to genuinely earn their spending money, and required to pay for their own extras out of their own funds, would easily understand the relatively low value of a cheap plastic toy. Especially in a family where the parents don’t simply cave to shut the kids up when they howl for this sort of thing. When little Johnny sweats for an hour to earn his dollar and knows that a free (to him) dinner will show up on the table at 6 o’clock, he’s going to be smart enough to figure out the real “value” of a happy meal and a piece of plastic.

Also, I don’t shop at either Target or Wal-mart. Like you, I think they are both very bad corporate “neighbors” and there’s no substantive difference between them.

http://adverlicio.us/topic/target

(hint: fun, trendy, hip … fashionable)

vs. Wal-Mart:

http://adverlicio.us/industry/wal_mart

(hint: some good stuff, but they’re clearly following the leader)

Wal Mart barely carries any furniture, and yet, Target carries something like a mission line, an “expresso/mocha” finish line, not to mention a couple more divergent wood/wood finish lines. We’re talking desks, bookcases, nightstands, armoires, recliners (in some cases), and the list goes on. They also offer a much broader array of kitchen table chairs and bar stools.

This all without even considering Target’s branded/endorsed soft goods lines.

So, I don’t agree that (unless every Wal Mart I’ve ever been in is below the corporate average) Target and Wal Mart differ only in advertising, or that they are primarily the same.

Just my observation, and I don’t have a financial interest in either store.

I think you’re right, it is a combination of things like corporate culture and as part of that, the people who work there.

Here, there are very noticeable differences in the make up of the employees at the two stores, particularly age wise.

And yes, experience is very important to me when making decisions.

I’ve been to both plenty of times to make a pretty accurate comparison (even when I didn’t have television service to inundate me with advertising).

I understand the powerful effect of marketing, but there is a real, physical difference here and likely in other places: bathrooms that are almost unusable they smell so bad vs. nice usuable facilities, aisles heaped with stuff and misplaced items vs. clear aisles, spilled goods and open packages vs. clean shelves, checkouts that take 10 minutes vs. checkouts that take 2.

Now, I’m not a store snob. I’m very price conscious and willing to put up with a lot to get a good deal. I’ve shopped at Walmart and Target both. And I shop a lot at Ross nowadays despite the fact that the atmosphere is Walmart-like. I shop at Ross, though, because the fashion brands there are better — and not just because of the name, but because they genuinely look and feel better. I know Walmart brands, I wore them for many years and it just never worked well for me.

All else being equal, why not choose the better atmosphere of Target over Walmart, though?

But things aren’t equal — because Target still has better style (in general) than Walmart when it comes to clothes and home decor. Of course, that’s a matter of taste, but it’s my taste so I’m entitled.

OK, in your area, which do you choose to shop at? Likely, you chose Target because you had a notion that it was “cleaner,” and you went to Target with the cue to notice the clean aspects. Similarly, you had the notion that WalMart was “bad” and you went there with the cue to notice the bad aspects. Thus, your opinions were reinforced.

If you hear lots of little whispers that something is bad or dirty, you’ll begin to see where it is bad or dirty. If you hear lots of little whispers that something is upscale, that’s what you’ll see, too.

Why do you think Tiffany’s can charge $1,000 extra for their jewelry to come in a blue box?

Interestingly, it can make a difference. In several university research studies, patients taking brand-name OTC pain medicines (e.g. Tylenol, Advil) experienced more pain relief than those taking the generic brand of the exact same pill. Marketing affects the mind!

“This is something I hope to teach to my children: brand doesn’t always mean what everyone says it means.” Exactly. It is also very important to teach them the very same thing about advertising.

My kids are 6 and 8 and they already know that companies need our money and so are trying to get us to buy stuff that we don’t really need. They know that there’s often a gap between a product’s image in an ad and the reality of that product’s functionality and quality.

It has really come a long way since I was a kid.

Best Wishes,
D4L