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	<title>Comments on: Is College Really Necessary For All High School Graduates?</title>
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	<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/</link>
	<description>Simple, applicable personal finance advice for the modern world</description>
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		<title>By: Bill in Houston</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/comment-page-3/#comment-752190</link>
		<dc:creator>Bill in Houston</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Aug 2009 18:29:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/#comment-752190</guid>
		<description>The Bell Curve shows that pretty much half of the population is not meant to go to college. The problem our country suffers from is Lake Woebegonitis, where we think all of our children are above average. This does children a great disservice. Worse, programs for non-college oriented people grow fewer and fewer as time progresses. Military service is a good career if you can handle the regimentation (as a side note, I did serve proudly in the USN). Trade schools, whether for carpentry or computer repair are needed more than ever.

College is not for everyone, but we don&#039;t have many other choices in careers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Bell Curve shows that pretty much half of the population is not meant to go to college. The problem our country suffers from is Lake Woebegonitis, where we think all of our children are above average. This does children a great disservice. Worse, programs for non-college oriented people grow fewer and fewer as time progresses. Military service is a good career if you can handle the regimentation (as a side note, I did serve proudly in the USN). Trade schools, whether for carpentry or computer repair are needed more than ever.</p>
<p>College is not for everyone, but we don&#8217;t have many other choices in careers.</p>
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		<title>By: Jeff</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/comment-page-3/#comment-672173</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 24 May 2009 17:56:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/#comment-672173</guid>
		<description>I am a college professor and here is my take on college degrees:

Only 1 in 4 Americans actually have a college degree.  Studies find on average that people who graduate with an undergraduate college degree on average make more about $10,000 more per year than HS graduates alone.  For every plumber making $60K+, there are dozens of people working minimum wage service jobs at Wal-mart, etc. so these explain the numbers.  

College graduates also live on average 4 years longer probably because they are better educated to understand medical care and make more. Graduates also are more likely to work in a job where they have health insurance benefits. 

Most Americans have some college, but most won&#039;t finish a degree.  Only about half of people who graduate with an undergraduate degree actually will work in the field they study.  

So, here is my advice to people who are looking to attend college or whose children may:

a. Read the Sunday paper&#039;s job ads.  It is all fine and dandy to nurture your child&#039;s potential or want to be a novelist, but what is going to pay your bills until you sell that first bestseller?  Ask yourself which of the jobs listed would you actually want to apply for.

b. If a job says &quot;College degree required&quot; -many do but don&#039;t specify the degree- then major in something you enjoy, will do well in, and will finish.

c. If the jobs you want to seek require a specific degree and training such as nursing or accounting, then pursue a major in these areas.

d. If the job you want doesn&#039;t have a specific major -such a meteorology- then major in something similar such as physical geography and seek out summer internships or jobs to give you training specifically in meteorology.  

e. In my experience with freshmen, most want to be physicians, lawyers, business people, or psychologists.  I believe I read where 1 in 6 college students get degrees in Biology and most don&#039;t go on into medical school.  Instead, consider alternate paths such a degrees in nutrition, food science, plant pathology, etc. that still require the chemistry and biology needed to apply to medical school but which open up more specialty jobs if you don&#039;t pursue medical school.  Similar, the bulk of counseling is done by LCSWs, licensed clinical social workers.  

f. Realize that what a college degree amounted to 30-40 years ago equates now to a Masters degree.  Average earnings jump considerably from HS diploma to undergraduate degree.  They jump even higher though not as much for a Masters.  Ironically, average incomes drop slightly if earning a PhD.

I find many undergraduate students graduate and are often clueless about their hiring potential.  They may have excelled in college but really have few or no skills UNLESS they studied a specialized, applied major.  Many lack experience in the areas they want to work.  If you start with the job ads and realize you want to prepare to win one of these jobs, you can structure your college career to best be prepared through the right major, possibly graduate school, and internships/part-time jobs in your intended career.

Yes, some people with HS degrees will make more, but the statistics show a college degree on average will open up higher pay, a longer healthier life, and often personal growth.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am a college professor and here is my take on college degrees:</p>
<p>Only 1 in 4 Americans actually have a college degree.  Studies find on average that people who graduate with an undergraduate college degree on average make more about $10,000 more per year than HS graduates alone.  For every plumber making $60K+, there are dozens of people working minimum wage service jobs at Wal-mart, etc. so these explain the numbers.  </p>
<p>College graduates also live on average 4 years longer probably because they are better educated to understand medical care and make more. Graduates also are more likely to work in a job where they have health insurance benefits. </p>
<p>Most Americans have some college, but most won&#8217;t finish a degree.  Only about half of people who graduate with an undergraduate degree actually will work in the field they study.  </p>
<p>So, here is my advice to people who are looking to attend college or whose children may:</p>
<p>a. Read the Sunday paper&#8217;s job ads.  It is all fine and dandy to nurture your child&#8217;s potential or want to be a novelist, but what is going to pay your bills until you sell that first bestseller?  Ask yourself which of the jobs listed would you actually want to apply for.</p>
<p>b. If a job says &#8220;College degree required&#8221; -many do but don&#8217;t specify the degree- then major in something you enjoy, will do well in, and will finish.</p>
<p>c. If the jobs you want to seek require a specific degree and training such as nursing or accounting, then pursue a major in these areas.</p>
<p>d. If the job you want doesn&#8217;t have a specific major -such a meteorology- then major in something similar such as physical geography and seek out summer internships or jobs to give you training specifically in meteorology.  </p>
<p>e. In my experience with freshmen, most want to be physicians, lawyers, business people, or psychologists.  I believe I read where 1 in 6 college students get degrees in Biology and most don&#8217;t go on into medical school.  Instead, consider alternate paths such a degrees in nutrition, food science, plant pathology, etc. that still require the chemistry and biology needed to apply to medical school but which open up more specialty jobs if you don&#8217;t pursue medical school.  Similar, the bulk of counseling is done by LCSWs, licensed clinical social workers.  </p>
<p>f. Realize that what a college degree amounted to 30-40 years ago equates now to a Masters degree.  Average earnings jump considerably from HS diploma to undergraduate degree.  They jump even higher though not as much for a Masters.  Ironically, average incomes drop slightly if earning a PhD.</p>
<p>I find many undergraduate students graduate and are often clueless about their hiring potential.  They may have excelled in college but really have few or no skills UNLESS they studied a specialized, applied major.  Many lack experience in the areas they want to work.  If you start with the job ads and realize you want to prepare to win one of these jobs, you can structure your college career to best be prepared through the right major, possibly graduate school, and internships/part-time jobs in your intended career.</p>
<p>Yes, some people with HS degrees will make more, but the statistics show a college degree on average will open up higher pay, a longer healthier life, and often personal growth.</p>
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		<title>By: Miranda</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/comment-page-3/#comment-560799</link>
		<dc:creator>Miranda</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Mar 2009 14:27:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/#comment-560799</guid>
		<description>I am still a highschool student, but I am really debating weither to go to college. I mean, I am not at all good at math, and my love is to write novels. So i don&#039;t see how I need math for writing books....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am still a highschool student, but I am really debating weither to go to college. I mean, I am not at all good at math, and my love is to write novels. So i don&#8217;t see how I need math for writing books&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: Ken Barker</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/comment-page-3/#comment-357683</link>
		<dc:creator>Ken Barker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Aug 2008 14:33:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/#comment-357683</guid>
		<description>College is not for everyone.  It never has been and never will be.  My wife and I are both college graduates as are our two children. All of us did well for ourselves financially, but college costs are outrageous today and many degrees are worth less than the paper they are written on.  Community Colleges and tecnical schools are much more meaningful for many students today than even an Ivy League degree.  There are even those who can learn valuable skills working for Mom or Dad in their own businesses than wasting their lives in four year colleges.  

Today, while getting my haircut, my barber - a former student of mine - told me that her son, a recent graduate of a community college, got his first job as a truck mechanic in Gillette, Wyoming.  He will receive $52,000 a year plus benefits for his services.  This was a young man who hated high school because so many courses seemed like a waste of time to him.  The Community College allowed him to focus on the courses that were most meaningful and practical to him.  This young man, to me, is more the rule than the exception.  His Dad is also a mechanic and he - the young man - has learned more from him than anyone else.  

All that glitters is not gold.  Wherever kids go to school, it is important that they choose a route that fits them best.  A sound education is much more than a feather in one&#039;s cap. It is a step that hopefully will lead to gainful empoloyment and a life that really matters.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>College is not for everyone.  It never has been and never will be.  My wife and I are both college graduates as are our two children. All of us did well for ourselves financially, but college costs are outrageous today and many degrees are worth less than the paper they are written on.  Community Colleges and tecnical schools are much more meaningful for many students today than even an Ivy League degree.  There are even those who can learn valuable skills working for Mom or Dad in their own businesses than wasting their lives in four year colleges.  </p>
<p>Today, while getting my haircut, my barber &#8211; a former student of mine &#8211; told me that her son, a recent graduate of a community college, got his first job as a truck mechanic in Gillette, Wyoming.  He will receive $52,000 a year plus benefits for his services.  This was a young man who hated high school because so many courses seemed like a waste of time to him.  The Community College allowed him to focus on the courses that were most meaningful and practical to him.  This young man, to me, is more the rule than the exception.  His Dad is also a mechanic and he &#8211; the young man &#8211; has learned more from him than anyone else.  </p>
<p>All that glitters is not gold.  Wherever kids go to school, it is important that they choose a route that fits them best.  A sound education is much more than a feather in one&#8217;s cap. It is a step that hopefully will lead to gainful empoloyment and a life that really matters.</p>
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		<title>By: steve</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/comment-page-3/#comment-356817</link>
		<dc:creator>steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Aug 2008 06:14:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/#comment-356817</guid>
		<description>&quot;Many big entrepreneurs never completed college - just ask Bill Gates. If you have an idea and a strong work ethic, you’re often making a strong choice chasing that dream instead of stopping and following a degree path.&quot;

I support this post, and think that probably the most important thing is for a young person to take themselves seriously and find a direction for themselves. I also suspect that while some schooling has value, actually, spending 12 years in what is essentially mandatory schooling (the student never gets to make a choice to attend, it is just assumed)  and learning to follow what the guy/gal at the front of the class is doing has a lot to do with stunting a person&#039;s self-direction before it even gets started.

Gates is an example of not only someone with incredibly strong determination, but extraordinary intellect. He left Harvard because he saw an opportunity to start a business.

I recently read a book by a man who taught a mathematics course that Bill Gates took when he was attending Harvard (Before he left to work full time on Microsoft).
In the book, this man describes assigning as homework an unsolved problem in mathematics. He expected to get some interesting work from his students that would be fodder for class discussion, and to stretch their abilities.

However, Bill Gates the undergrad came in to his office the next day with the proof (solution).  

The professor says that Gates was perhaps the smartest person he has EVER met and had the opportunity to teach.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Many big entrepreneurs never completed college &#8211; just ask Bill Gates. If you have an idea and a strong work ethic, you’re often making a strong choice chasing that dream instead of stopping and following a degree path.&#8221;</p>
<p>I support this post, and think that probably the most important thing is for a young person to take themselves seriously and find a direction for themselves. I also suspect that while some schooling has value, actually, spending 12 years in what is essentially mandatory schooling (the student never gets to make a choice to attend, it is just assumed)  and learning to follow what the guy/gal at the front of the class is doing has a lot to do with stunting a person&#8217;s self-direction before it even gets started.</p>
<p>Gates is an example of not only someone with incredibly strong determination, but extraordinary intellect. He left Harvard because he saw an opportunity to start a business.</p>
<p>I recently read a book by a man who taught a mathematics course that Bill Gates took when he was attending Harvard (Before he left to work full time on Microsoft).<br />
In the book, this man describes assigning as homework an unsolved problem in mathematics. He expected to get some interesting work from his students that would be fodder for class discussion, and to stretch their abilities.</p>
<p>However, Bill Gates the undergrad came in to his office the next day with the proof (solution).  </p>
<p>The professor says that Gates was perhaps the smartest person he has EVER met and had the opportunity to teach.</p>
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		<title>By: Kenny</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/comment-page-2/#comment-356148</link>
		<dc:creator>Kenny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Aug 2008 07:46:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/#comment-356148</guid>
		<description>I hear you guys......Success can be planned and planted in many young minds, but it has to be done with a focus, and started, at an early age.  

Look at my Blog site that gives a lot of success characteristics.  Most of them are easier said than done, but being an immigrant parent, I know only one thing and that is &#039;Design Success and You Shall Have Success&#039;.  I am proving this point to my kids and they are showing early signs of good (small) successes through their middle school and high school.  This should pave the way for a good future (lawyer, doctor, pharmacy, scientist, bio-technologist etc).  

My kids put in 40-50 hours a week of extra reading/education/tutoring through the summer, enjoying the rest of the time sleeping, watching movie, playing video games, doing soccer/bicycling  type of outside activities etc.

I have planned for their college with my savings, and will continue to be an &#039;enabler&#039; of their future.  

This is what my Dad did for me, while I DID my part.  

Of course, it all depends on kids, cooperation from God and the way they climb over the road-blocks in their lives.  

So, hope for the best, AFTER, doing your best.  

Kenny - A small Blogger at MySite</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I hear you guys&#8230;&#8230;Success can be planned and planted in many young minds, but it has to be done with a focus, and started, at an early age.  </p>
<p>Look at my Blog site that gives a lot of success characteristics.  Most of them are easier said than done, but being an immigrant parent, I know only one thing and that is &#8216;Design Success and You Shall Have Success&#8217;.  I am proving this point to my kids and they are showing early signs of good (small) successes through their middle school and high school.  This should pave the way for a good future (lawyer, doctor, pharmacy, scientist, bio-technologist etc).  </p>
<p>My kids put in 40-50 hours a week of extra reading/education/tutoring through the summer, enjoying the rest of the time sleeping, watching movie, playing video games, doing soccer/bicycling  type of outside activities etc.</p>
<p>I have planned for their college with my savings, and will continue to be an &#8216;enabler&#8217; of their future.  </p>
<p>This is what my Dad did for me, while I DID my part.  </p>
<p>Of course, it all depends on kids, cooperation from God and the way they climb over the road-blocks in their lives.  </p>
<p>So, hope for the best, AFTER, doing your best.  </p>
<p>Kenny &#8211; A small Blogger at MySite</p>
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		<title>By: NYCtek</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/comment-page-2/#comment-351687</link>
		<dc:creator>NYCtek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Aug 2008 15:35:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/#comment-351687</guid>
		<description>I left college after one year and starting working in IT; I pull in about $1000 a week. I&#039;m still in my twenties.

My roommate is a neuroscientist. He worked dutifully unpaid for two years to get the job he has now, and nets a meager $500 a week. He barely affords his rent and food since we live in NYC.

I don&#039;t tell him how much I make -- I don&#039;t have the heart. He excitedly tells me that, with perseverance, he may one day see $750 a week, if he gets his PhD...

...at least he loves what he is doing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I left college after one year and starting working in IT; I pull in about $1000 a week. I&#8217;m still in my twenties.</p>
<p>My roommate is a neuroscientist. He worked dutifully unpaid for two years to get the job he has now, and nets a meager $500 a week. He barely affords his rent and food since we live in NYC.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t tell him how much I make &#8212; I don&#8217;t have the heart. He excitedly tells me that, with perseverance, he may one day see $750 a week, if he gets his PhD&#8230;</p>
<p>&#8230;at least he loves what he is doing.</p>
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		<title>By: kevin</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/comment-page-2/#comment-349490</link>
		<dc:creator>kevin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 09:20:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/#comment-349490</guid>
		<description>I agree with Trent.  The book the Millionaire Next Door (or maybe it was the follow-up makes the point that lots of millionaires never went to college.  And in fact, just not everyone is cut out for college.  Me, for example.  I stuck it out and graduated and now I make extremely good money.  The only catch being I absolutely hated to social scene at college, and while I do have a good job it is a constant source of stres in my life.

I think when my son gets older I will somewhat follow Trent&#039;s path.  And where is it written that you have to start college right away?  Why not take a year and work some different jobs.  See what you like.  Grow up a little and then start college.  Thanks again Trent.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with Trent.  The book the Millionaire Next Door (or maybe it was the follow-up makes the point that lots of millionaires never went to college.  And in fact, just not everyone is cut out for college.  Me, for example.  I stuck it out and graduated and now I make extremely good money.  The only catch being I absolutely hated to social scene at college, and while I do have a good job it is a constant source of stres in my life.</p>
<p>I think when my son gets older I will somewhat follow Trent&#8217;s path.  And where is it written that you have to start college right away?  Why not take a year and work some different jobs.  See what you like.  Grow up a little and then start college.  Thanks again Trent.</p>
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		<title>By: Carrie</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/comment-page-2/#comment-348809</link>
		<dc:creator>Carrie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Aug 2008 13:32:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/#comment-348809</guid>
		<description>My husband never went to college - he didn&#039;t know what he wanted to major in, so he didn&#039;t want to spend the money on it.  Instead, he got in to a specialty trade, and has been financially and professionally successful.  He makes more money than a good number of college graduates I know.  I, on the other hand, earned my bachelors, and did exceedingly well in school.  I have been a homemaker since I married about a year after college, of my own choice.

For us, the fact of getting, or not getting, a degree has had little bearing on the &quot;successfulness&quot; of our financial lives.

So, I say, kudos to Trent for speaking up for the idea that college isn&#039;t vital.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My husband never went to college &#8211; he didn&#8217;t know what he wanted to major in, so he didn&#8217;t want to spend the money on it.  Instead, he got in to a specialty trade, and has been financially and professionally successful.  He makes more money than a good number of college graduates I know.  I, on the other hand, earned my bachelors, and did exceedingly well in school.  I have been a homemaker since I married about a year after college, of my own choice.</p>
<p>For us, the fact of getting, or not getting, a degree has had little bearing on the &#8220;successfulness&#8221; of our financial lives.</p>
<p>So, I say, kudos to Trent for speaking up for the idea that college isn&#8217;t vital.</p>
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		<title>By: Carrie</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/comment-page-2/#comment-348808</link>
		<dc:creator>Carrie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Aug 2008 13:32:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/#comment-348808</guid>
		<description>My husband never went to college - he didn&#039;t know what he wanted to major in, so he didn&#039;t want to spend the money on it.  Instead, he got in to a specialty trade, and has been financially and professionally successful.  He makes more money than a good number of college graduates I know.  I, on the other hand, earned my bachelors, and did exceedingly well in school.  I have been a homemaker since I married about a year after college, of my own choice.

For us, the fact of getting, or not getting, a degree has had little bearing on the &quot;successfulness&quot; of our financial lives.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My husband never went to college &#8211; he didn&#8217;t know what he wanted to major in, so he didn&#8217;t want to spend the money on it.  Instead, he got in to a specialty trade, and has been financially and professionally successful.  He makes more money than a good number of college graduates I know.  I, on the other hand, earned my bachelors, and did exceedingly well in school.  I have been a homemaker since I married about a year after college, of my own choice.</p>
<p>For us, the fact of getting, or not getting, a degree has had little bearing on the &#8220;successfulness&#8221; of our financial lives.</p>
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		<title>By: Lynne</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/comment-page-2/#comment-348662</link>
		<dc:creator>Lynne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Aug 2008 06:28:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/#comment-348662</guid>
		<description>I have 2 children &amp; 3 step-children. The oldest went to a trade school, is a mechanic &amp; has owned his own repair shop for 18 years. The next son has no education after high school, but entered a trade and is now a general contractor. #3 step-son works for a home improvement store. #4th child, my daughter, began college, could never get the classes she needed, so enrolled in a business school. Got her degree in legal administration and has been working ever since (10yrs.) for the same company at a very good wage with fantastic benefits. My youngest son had planned to go to a trade school to learn air conditioning, etc. trade. Didn&#039;t do that, but followed his love of woodworking. He has been self employed for several years now and doing wonderfully. I will say that all of them found what they really liked to do and used that to focus on building a future.
Ea</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have 2 children &amp; 3 step-children. The oldest went to a trade school, is a mechanic &amp; has owned his own repair shop for 18 years. The next son has no education after high school, but entered a trade and is now a general contractor. #3 step-son works for a home improvement store. #4th child, my daughter, began college, could never get the classes she needed, so enrolled in a business school. Got her degree in legal administration and has been working ever since (10yrs.) for the same company at a very good wage with fantastic benefits. My youngest son had planned to go to a trade school to learn air conditioning, etc. trade. Didn&#8217;t do that, but followed his love of woodworking. He has been self employed for several years now and doing wonderfully. I will say that all of them found what they really liked to do and used that to focus on building a future.<br />
Ea</p>
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		<title>By: ChangeForA20</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/comment-page-2/#comment-348466</link>
		<dc:creator>ChangeForA20</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Aug 2008 00:53:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/#comment-348466</guid>
		<description>This is a very interesting post, not a topic I have seen discussed in the PF community but definitely one that deserves some attention.

I am currently between my 3rd and 4th year of college.  The first 3 years of my college education cost about $60,000 (pretty inexpensive in comparison to my peers).  This summer I took an internship and without question I have learned more valuable information and gained more real world experience in 1 month than I have in my 3 years at college.

Unfortunately, it has become a social norm to pursue higher education after graduating from high school and I have simply conformed to the norm.

However, I commend your decision to not force a college education upon your children.  My parents took the same approach to an extent, and it just so happened that college was in the deck regardless.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is a very interesting post, not a topic I have seen discussed in the PF community but definitely one that deserves some attention.</p>
<p>I am currently between my 3rd and 4th year of college.  The first 3 years of my college education cost about $60,000 (pretty inexpensive in comparison to my peers).  This summer I took an internship and without question I have learned more valuable information and gained more real world experience in 1 month than I have in my 3 years at college.</p>
<p>Unfortunately, it has become a social norm to pursue higher education after graduating from high school and I have simply conformed to the norm.</p>
<p>However, I commend your decision to not force a college education upon your children.  My parents took the same approach to an extent, and it just so happened that college was in the deck regardless.</p>
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		<title>By: Treva</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/comment-page-2/#comment-348374</link>
		<dc:creator>Treva</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Aug 2008 23:25:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/#comment-348374</guid>
		<description>Thanks for this article, Trent.  At one point when my daughter was first born I felt some pressure from a financial advisor to invest in a 529 college savings plan.  I explained to him that I don&#039;t expect my child to go to college unless she wants to and what if she wants to go to a trade school instead?  He told me that money could then wait for a grandchild.  He wasn&#039;t kidding.  Neither was I when told him NO in no uncertain terms.

In addition to the above, I must ask: Why do so many parents feel obligated to put their children through college?  My parents didn&#039;t have the money for me to go, so I had to figure out how to do it myself.  We live within our means and have very few extras; we can barely save for retirement let alone our  daughter&#039;s possible future education.  It is not that I won&#039;t support her in her endeavors; I will.  I will provide her a home, food, etc.  But as I see it right now she will have to pay her own way through college.  Personally, I feel this is best.  If she has to work for it, she&#039;ll appreciate it more.  College does not have to be an experience living a few hundred or more miles from home.  An adult child can study where he/she chooses while living at home.  Only for the truly unique areas of study would a student need to travel so far.  For something more commonplace (teacher, accountant, business management) most people could study much closer to home making college a more easily obtainable pay-as-go situation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for this article, Trent.  At one point when my daughter was first born I felt some pressure from a financial advisor to invest in a 529 college savings plan.  I explained to him that I don&#8217;t expect my child to go to college unless she wants to and what if she wants to go to a trade school instead?  He told me that money could then wait for a grandchild.  He wasn&#8217;t kidding.  Neither was I when told him NO in no uncertain terms.</p>
<p>In addition to the above, I must ask: Why do so many parents feel obligated to put their children through college?  My parents didn&#8217;t have the money for me to go, so I had to figure out how to do it myself.  We live within our means and have very few extras; we can barely save for retirement let alone our  daughter&#8217;s possible future education.  It is not that I won&#8217;t support her in her endeavors; I will.  I will provide her a home, food, etc.  But as I see it right now she will have to pay her own way through college.  Personally, I feel this is best.  If she has to work for it, she&#8217;ll appreciate it more.  College does not have to be an experience living a few hundred or more miles from home.  An adult child can study where he/she chooses while living at home.  Only for the truly unique areas of study would a student need to travel so far.  For something more commonplace (teacher, accountant, business management) most people could study much closer to home making college a more easily obtainable pay-as-go situation.</p>
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		<title>By: Tyler</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/comment-page-2/#comment-348198</link>
		<dc:creator>Tyler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Aug 2008 19:23:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/#comment-348198</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t like to look at it as a &quot;37.6% chance&quot; that a student will get a bachelor&#039;s degree within 6 years, but that 37.6% of students DO get bachelor&#039;s degrees within 6 years of graduating high school.  There&#039;s no &quot;chance&quot; about it.  

At the school I went to, I only know of a couple people that had their education paid for by their parents.  I didn&#039;t get a dime from mine, and I never expected anything either.  Most of my friends are in the same boat.  I worked my tail off and paid my own way.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t like to look at it as a &#8220;37.6% chance&#8221; that a student will get a bachelor&#8217;s degree within 6 years, but that 37.6% of students DO get bachelor&#8217;s degrees within 6 years of graduating high school.  There&#8217;s no &#8220;chance&#8221; about it.  </p>
<p>At the school I went to, I only know of a couple people that had their education paid for by their parents.  I didn&#8217;t get a dime from mine, and I never expected anything either.  Most of my friends are in the same boat.  I worked my tail off and paid my own way.</p>
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		<title>By: a conscious life</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/comment-page-2/#comment-348163</link>
		<dc:creator>a conscious life</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Aug 2008 18:32:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/#comment-348163</guid>
		<description>I love the vibes you&#039;re putting out there about college.  IF following your dreams includes college, then that&#039;s what will be done... but, I agree, college isn&#039;t necessary for everyone.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love the vibes you&#8217;re putting out there about college.  IF following your dreams includes college, then that&#8217;s what will be done&#8230; but, I agree, college isn&#8217;t necessary for everyone.</p>
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		<title>By: Natalie Wickham</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/comment-page-2/#comment-348077</link>
		<dc:creator>Natalie Wickham</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Aug 2008 17:05:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/#comment-348077</guid>
		<description>Yes, yes, yes! Thank you so much for this post, Trent! I totally agree and think it&#039;s wonderful that as a parent, you are leaving the options open for your children. I have had relatives disparage me because I chose not to go to college. Funny thing was...one who was quite vocal in criticizing me had a history degree and was working a day job in a tanning salon while I was several years into running my own successful business and serving in professional associations.

There are so many opportunities in the world now for expanding one&#039;s education, developing skills and establishing businesses that I think it is very short-sighted for our society to keep placing such importance on college as the primary (or only) path to success.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, yes, yes! Thank you so much for this post, Trent! I totally agree and think it&#8217;s wonderful that as a parent, you are leaving the options open for your children. I have had relatives disparage me because I chose not to go to college. Funny thing was&#8230;one who was quite vocal in criticizing me had a history degree and was working a day job in a tanning salon while I was several years into running my own successful business and serving in professional associations.</p>
<p>There are so many opportunities in the world now for expanding one&#8217;s education, developing skills and establishing businesses that I think it is very short-sighted for our society to keep placing such importance on college as the primary (or only) path to success.</p>
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		<title>By: just me</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/comment-page-2/#comment-348061</link>
		<dc:creator>just me</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Aug 2008 16:50:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/#comment-348061</guid>
		<description>Steve Sailer has an interesting take on the whole thing - it is no longer legal to have IQ tests for jobs- hence the use of college degrees as a barrier to entry/filter...the problem has become just that - beginning with grade inflation in the sixties (give a kid a C, you send him to &#039;Nam) and continuing with &quot;If a ghetto kid flunks out, you&#039;re denying him opportunity&quot; ...thus the degree has become worthless not to mention absurdly expensive - college costs have risen far above inflation while the worth of the degree is less and less - just like a devaluing currency. 

I do know a thing or two about one form of education:: art training - anyone wishing to become a fine arist can waste four years and 100,000 at PRatt, Yale, etc have a &#039;degree&#039; and know NOTHING (i am not exaggerating here, I really mean nothing) about painting the human figure. On the other hand, one can go to a non degree atelier (like all the old masters did) pay about $300.00 a month full time - and become a master level painter. 

In fact many artists who get &#039;serious&#039; about art after college go on to Atelier programs and look back at their BFA&#039;s as wastes of time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Steve Sailer has an interesting take on the whole thing &#8211; it is no longer legal to have IQ tests for jobs- hence the use of college degrees as a barrier to entry/filter&#8230;the problem has become just that &#8211; beginning with grade inflation in the sixties (give a kid a C, you send him to &#8216;Nam) and continuing with &#8220;If a ghetto kid flunks out, you&#8217;re denying him opportunity&#8221; &#8230;thus the degree has become worthless not to mention absurdly expensive &#8211; college costs have risen far above inflation while the worth of the degree is less and less &#8211; just like a devaluing currency. </p>
<p>I do know a thing or two about one form of education:: art training &#8211; anyone wishing to become a fine arist can waste four years and 100,000 at PRatt, Yale, etc have a &#8216;degree&#8217; and know NOTHING (i am not exaggerating here, I really mean nothing) about painting the human figure. On the other hand, one can go to a non degree atelier (like all the old masters did) pay about $300.00 a month full time &#8211; and become a master level painter. </p>
<p>In fact many artists who get &#8217;serious&#8217; about art after college go on to Atelier programs and look back at their BFA&#8217;s as wastes of time.</p>
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		<title>By: B</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/comment-page-2/#comment-348053</link>
		<dc:creator>B</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Aug 2008 16:42:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/#comment-348053</guid>
		<description>Wow. For a person who wants me to trust his novice but purportedly well-reasoned personal finance advice your estimates here are WAY off base for your kids. First, does the overall high school graduation rate approximate the appropriate comparison group for your kids? No. How many kids with college educated parents don&#039;t complete high school? College? Second, ON AVERAGE do college educated people make more than those that only complete a high school education? Yes. Quite a bit more in fact. Does that mean that there aren&#039;t under and over performers? No. Does that mean that the people that didn&#039;t go to college aren&#039;t happy or financially viable? Or that the people who earned more are? No. But averages are like the index funds of stocks. On average, should you expect that your kids will aspire to a college education? Yes. So, are the books recommending that you save for your children&#039;s educations assuming that college is necessary? Maybe. But maybe they&#039;re anticipating that parents savvy to personal finance don&#039;t want their kids to have to take on huge amounts of debt in order to go to college (if they so choose). Most kids will be grateful that their parents aspired for them to do great things and become good people by saving for their future (college or not) in whatever way they could. Does any reasonable person actually disagree with the underlying sentiment, &quot;one does not have to go to college to be successful?&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow. For a person who wants me to trust his novice but purportedly well-reasoned personal finance advice your estimates here are WAY off base for your kids. First, does the overall high school graduation rate approximate the appropriate comparison group for your kids? No. How many kids with college educated parents don&#8217;t complete high school? College? Second, ON AVERAGE do college educated people make more than those that only complete a high school education? Yes. Quite a bit more in fact. Does that mean that there aren&#8217;t under and over performers? No. Does that mean that the people that didn&#8217;t go to college aren&#8217;t happy or financially viable? Or that the people who earned more are? No. But averages are like the index funds of stocks. On average, should you expect that your kids will aspire to a college education? Yes. So, are the books recommending that you save for your children&#8217;s educations assuming that college is necessary? Maybe. But maybe they&#8217;re anticipating that parents savvy to personal finance don&#8217;t want their kids to have to take on huge amounts of debt in order to go to college (if they so choose). Most kids will be grateful that their parents aspired for them to do great things and become good people by saving for their future (college or not) in whatever way they could. Does any reasonable person actually disagree with the underlying sentiment, &#8220;one does not have to go to college to be successful?&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Jason</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/comment-page-2/#comment-348006</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Aug 2008 16:01:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/#comment-348006</guid>
		<description>College is absolutely not *necessary* for everyone.  Nor does it mean you have to learn a trade or join the military.  It&#039;s possible to have a great, high-paying career with little or no college education.  College doesn&#039;t equal a good career, and no college doesn&#039;t have to mean a bad one.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>College is absolutely not *necessary* for everyone.  Nor does it mean you have to learn a trade or join the military.  It&#8217;s possible to have a great, high-paying career with little or no college education.  College doesn&#8217;t equal a good career, and no college doesn&#8217;t have to mean a bad one.</p>
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		<title>By: Carolyn</title>
		<link>http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/comment-page-2/#comment-347976</link>
		<dc:creator>Carolyn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Aug 2008 15:27:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/05/is-college-really-necessary-for-all-high-school-graduates/#comment-347976</guid>
		<description>I was the proverbial &#039;good student&#039; in high school and went to college immediately after graduation because it was the natural next step.  What a mistake.  I had no idea what I wanted to do with myself and convinced that the things I was interested in were too hard, picked a school and major at random, and hated every moment of the two years I was there.  Two years that would have been much better spent working some low-paying, PITA job that would have taught me the value of a college education and doing what I loved for the rest of my life.  I did eventually go back to school, and got my bachelor&#039;s in engineering at age 28.  

I can&#039;t agree more with the concept that allowing your children to develop their own interests and passions is much more important than teaching them that the right college is the only right choice.  Had I gotten the tiniest amount of encouragement from the beginning, maybe I wouldn&#039;t have been so afraid of pursuing my passions.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was the proverbial &#8216;good student&#8217; in high school and went to college immediately after graduation because it was the natural next step.  What a mistake.  I had no idea what I wanted to do with myself and convinced that the things I was interested in were too hard, picked a school and major at random, and hated every moment of the two years I was there.  Two years that would have been much better spent working some low-paying, PITA job that would have taught me the value of a college education and doing what I loved for the rest of my life.  I did eventually go back to school, and got my bachelor&#8217;s in engineering at age 28.  </p>
<p>I can&#8217;t agree more with the concept that allowing your children to develop their own interests and passions is much more important than teaching them that the right college is the only right choice.  Had I gotten the tiniest amount of encouragement from the beginning, maybe I wouldn&#8217;t have been so afraid of pursuing my passions.</p>
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