Comments on: The Total Money Makeover: Two More Hurdles

By: jarobins

jarobins — Sun, 19 Jul 2009 04:05:36 +0000

I purchased TMM 7/16/09 and just finished reading it! This is an awesome book that anyone should be able to follow the principles because they are truly spelled out in layman’s terms! Dave is right on the money when he says there are alot of intelligent people who are BROKE!

By: Trent

Trent — Tue, 14 Jul 2009 20:18:05 +0000

“Which is it? Oh, so it’s a balance? Well, then, how do we manage the balance?”

You can leave a good impression without spending money. Keep yourself clean. Use good basic hygiene. Try to be confident in how you act. Share worthwhile information and ideas in a positive way. Those things cost nothing and do a powerful job of leaving a great impression without spending money.

By: Steven@HundredGoals.com

Steven@HundredGoals.com — Tue, 14 Jul 2009 15:42:07 +0000

Trent, this is a great article. By including your personal story to emphasize Dave’s arguement you really hit home these points. You tell your story eloquently and reading it I can practically feel the stress and worry in your life at those moments. Fantastic work!

By: George

George — Sun, 12 Jul 2009 16:42:07 +0000

I think there’s a strong potential for mixed messages.

a) Don’t spend to impress others.
b) Make sure you leave a good impression or you won’t advance your career.

Which is it? Oh, so it’s a balance? Well, then, how do we manage the balance?

By: Eli

Eli — Sun, 12 Jul 2009 16:38:17 +0000

I’m with MattJ, I think you may have typed in the wrong word in your first bold statement. You end up contradicting exactly what the paraphrase states.

Should be:
Ignorance is not a lack of INTELLIGENCE.
Ignorance is in fact a lack of knowledge (or as he states, “know-how”)

Your argument below is fine but your wording threw me for a second.

By: Michelle

Michelle — Sun, 12 Jul 2009 12:12:03 +0000

I truly believe that due to this widespread financial ignorance, many people were preyed upon by unscrupulous individuals & companies, contributing to the financial crisis that is affecting many of us. Ignorance is not an excuse, but it does take a lot of work to overcome…and by the time many go through the steps, they’ve already put themselves in a position where it’s difficult to get out of debt/trouble…

By: Kimberly

Kimberly — Sun, 12 Jul 2009 05:02:02 +0000

I wanted to add that the great thing with this recession is that a lot of people are getting away from trying to impress others. It is almost cool these days to tell people that you don’t use credit cards or are eating at home to save cash.

By: Kimberly

Kimberly — Sun, 12 Jul 2009 04:59:50 +0000

I get your point here, but a good marriage does not=a facade and a good career does not equal someone who has taken time from their family. Some of us are responsible, good workers who have a good career and have time for our families, and some of us picked a loving partner and got it right the first time around.

By: Kelley

Kelley — Sat, 11 Jul 2009 20:17:16 +0000

Trent: “The idea that ignorance is not a lack of knowledge is vital.”
I read this and was completely stopped. Ignorance is exactly a lack of knowlege. Ignorance can be cured with the application of intelligence and determination, exactly as you describe further in the paragraph.
OK, now maybe I can get to the rest of the article! (Sorry, my hangup, but I just couldn’t get past that statement.)

By: WilliamB

WilliamB — Sat, 11 Jul 2009 19:59:36 +0000

“The idea that ignorance is not a lack of KNOWLEDGE is vital.”

I think what Trent meant to write was “The idea that ignorance is not a lack of INTELLIGENCE is vital.”

A very good writer, Lois McMaster Bujold, had one of her characters say that educated is what you are when you get [of school], not what you are going in. More than one friend of mine has, when intimidated by the idea of a fancy school or a better-educated classmate, found comfort in this. (This is one reason I like Bujold, her human insights help me in real life.)

I agree with Trent: admitting ignorance is a characteristic of all my smart friends. So is a thirst for learning. One reason I like them is we trade knowledge bases. I share how to cook or the latest in international finance, my friend teaches me about electricity or why a diesel car doesn’t need a carburator.

When just starting out to learn something new, I suggest trying the children’s section of the library. How-to books for kids tend to be stripped down to the basics and carefully organized – just what I need when I’m in total ignorance.

By: Richby30

Richby30 — Sat, 11 Jul 2009 17:25:36 +0000

I really think education is the key to financial freedom. Dave Ramsey clearly has the right message out there.

Rgds, Laser

http://richby30retireby40.blogspot.com/

By: Hope D

Hope D — Sat, 11 Jul 2009 17:24:28 +0000

I was always amazed how my father could do anything. He can do a little carpentry, a little plumbing, a little electrical work and car repair. He taught my brothers his skills. Two brothers became carpenters and the other is a very skilled mechanic, owning his own garage. He also taught my sisters and I some of these skills. One sister does landscaping and painting. The oldest does landscaping and roofed her own very large garage. Another sister is a great painter and can drywall. I can do a little of everything and am always ready to learn more. We also learned various skills from our mother.
The interesting thing about my father’s skills are, he was raised without a father. His grandfather taught him a little, but most of his knowledge was gained from a need to know. He bought an old car, so he bought a book on how to fix it. He bought an old house, so he bought a book on how to take care of it. He and my mother showed their kids how with a little knowledge and a little work, you can save a huge amount of money and have beautiful things.

By: Prosperity Trekker

Prosperity Trekker — Sat, 11 Jul 2009 17:18:31 +0000

“Ignorance” and “expectations”…who doesn’t already know we need to reduce debt, spend less and save more (and exercise more and eat better foods)? We have an ample supply of diet books and and ample supply of personal finance books. What’s needed is the diligence and conviction to restore our financial (and physical) health. We need to sit down, make a personal plan to restore our financial health…and then, importantly, work the plan.

What is helpful to all of us is that there is a new mindset of austerity. It provides us with a foundation for saving that we didn’t have before.

Good post and comments.

By: Rosa

Rosa — Sat, 11 Jul 2009 17:16:29 +0000

What a great insight, that you were treating people to dinner for yourself, not for them – and that sometimes it was making them uncomfortable.

@Steve Weaver – I do know how desperate many older people are. We used to rent out rooms in our house and when I made the mistake of placing a Craigslist ad we got a TON of people calling who we just couldn’t accomodate -all older, single men who couldn’t live with the only bathroom being on the second floor. Even with the housing bubble bursting, the rental market in that kind of price range hasn’t gotten any better.

By: MattJ

MattJ — Sat, 11 Jul 2009 17:08:22 +0000

Trent: “The idea that ignorance is not a lack of knowledge is vital.”

Based on the rest of what you’ve written, I’m sure you got his message, but your attempted restatement is incorrect. He says that ignorance is not a lack of intelligence, and he’s right. On the other hand, ignorance IS a lack of knowledge – that’s its dictionary definition.

By: steve weaver

steve weaver — Sat, 11 Jul 2009 16:41:23 +0000

Will Rogers once said, “Everyone is ignorant…..only on different subjects”.
That quote seemed especially appropriate for this post.
Now to address my form of “The other side of the coin”. I’ve always been poor, or pretty close to it, mainly because I’m just not a materialistic person and care little about the opinions other may have of me. Only recently have I begun to worry about my future. I started establishing credit 3.5 years ago with a 500 dollar secured credit card. Fifteen months later I made the worst financial decision of my life, (Believing it would be worth it to raise my credit score!) I bought a new car. Two years later, I would love to get a home of my own but my debt, and low income, greatly reduces the chances and choices. Thanks to the massive drop in home prices,(especially in the Orlando area) it is now possible, if not probable, for me to do this.
I don’t care how ugly and small the house is, I just don’t want to end up like so many people I’ve known, who had nothing to live on except a meager stipend from Social Security. Unless you’ve seen a few people who literally live off the kindness of others (Who ironically are often barely in better shape.), you may not know how sad these elderly peoples lives have become.
My point in sharing this is twofold: 1)While not being too concerned with material things is usually a good thing, when taken to extremes it can cause untold hardship later & 2) It’s never too late to start building a better future.
I’m 48 years old, with a little luck, persistence and study, I believe I can retire at 68 with my home paid for and enough to live comfortably, though not lavishly, until my death.
Thanks Trent, for providing me with an excellent place to study. Rest assured, this isn’t my only source of material but it IS one of the most helpful. THANKS AGAIN!

By: guinness416

guinness416 — Sat, 11 Jul 2009 16:21:11 +0000

I think this is a great summary with the exception of the American Nightmare bit. While there are financial train wrecks all over the place saying people are “often” like this is a bit weird. I have no idea what sort of crowd you run with obviously, but I certainly know a number of people who own nice cars (and even homes) debt-free and have great careers without sacrificing friendships/family to get there. Which isn’t to say they haven’t worked hard for these things in one way or another, but it just seems … I don’t know, uncharitable or reverse-snobbish (I’m in the know, not these idiots with the BMWs!) to assume they’re living some behind the scenes horror show, to me. Which attitude isn’t uncommon in moneyblog articles and comments.

By: Generation Y Investor

Generation Y Investor — Sat, 11 Jul 2009 16:20:17 +0000

I really liked your (and Dave’s) explanation of the difference between intelligence vs ignorance. I’ve always said that you can learn just as much, if not more from reading books and researching a subject with a passion than taking expensive classes. (Not saying that college is bad though).

I’m not really sure what my “jaguar” would be. I don’t really spend money to empress people; although, I’m surrounded by people do every day living in nyc. I do spend a good amount of money going to great restaurants, but that’s one of my passions and I don’t spend a lot in other areas (ie transportation).

There’s nothing wrong with spending money on things your passionate about. Just make sure to balance it out by spending less in other areas of your life and living below your means overall.

On a side note, this has to be one of the best blogs I read. The writing is great and the comments are equally good.

-Gen Y Investor

By: Derek Epperson

Derek Epperson — Sat, 11 Jul 2009 16:15:06 +0000

Trent:

I’ve read most of your reviews of the chapters of Total Money Makeover, and I think you’ve made some very fair assessments – even in the parts where you don’t agree.

I find that when you don’t necessarily agree with something in the book, it’s easily seen as a matter of ‘personal finance maturity.’ Some people need to go cold turkey or have it fed to them straight-laced. But those who have “grown-up” in responsible PF (much as you have described in your blog) and are determined and responsible might make good decisions outside the principles.

My thought: you can always learn something, so a reader shouldn’t knock the whole book for one thing they might disagree with.

Keep up the good work.

By: ann

ann — Sat, 11 Jul 2009 16:03:04 +0000

My favorite quote, and I think it’s from Dave Ramsey: “You are spending money you don’t have, to buy things you don’t want, to impress people you don’t like.” That is so true of lots of people.

I’ve never been a “follow the crowd” kind of girl. Good thing, since we didn’t have a lot of money when I was growing up. When everyone was wearing Izod polos, I was wearing the JCPenney Fox. Guess what? My friends still liked me. Maybe it was a great lesson to learn young.