Comments on: When Parental Money Lessons Backfire

By: dagny

dagny — Thu, 04 Mar 2010 14:41:01 +0000

Those machines, and gambling in general, hook people via “variable ratio reinforcement”.
The first time I went to Las Vegas (late 70′s), I looked around at all the casinos and hotels and thought “these were not built by people winning”. Then again, I’m a quantitative thinker.

By: Brittany

Brittany — Wed, 03 Mar 2010 20:12:18 +0000

Correct me if I’m wrong, because I’ve only parented siblings and not my own children… but don’t you want to start teaching children about money BEFORE they have a concept of it, so you can shape the concept instead of reform ideas they already have? A 2 year old might not understand why mom and dad are giving her pieces of metal and then taking them away when she wants candy, but eventually she’ll grasp that she can have M&Ms if she has quarters left, but will have to wait until she gets more quarters if she uses them all before she can get new M&Ms (therefore subtly introducing the concept that money can be exchanged for items you want, but that it is limited in supply so you have to be careful how/when you spend it).

By: Laura

Laura — Wed, 03 Mar 2010 18:23:35 +0000

This made me laugh – my younger sister is an absolute CHAMP at those machines. She literally won a prize 75% of the time – and this after similar lectures from our parents about how they were scams. Kind of a random skill, but some people do have it!

By: nancy

nancy — Wed, 03 Mar 2010 14:38:03 +0000

I know you are trying to teach your children at a young age the value of money. 2 is a little early. I know you should start early but my almost 2 year old has no concept of money. If she wanted to waste her money ont he claw machine so be it. We all have to learn thes lessons early. Both my children have bank accounts the 2 year old I save on her behalf. My son is 9 and we started at 4 when he could understand money. My 9 year old makes deposits and decides to save or spend. Generally he spends but now he is saving for a specific item when he saves half I will put in the other half.

By: anne

anne — Wed, 03 Mar 2010 02:56:16 +0000

ok- i can’t help it- i have to tell you what my friend’s kids do-

they pool their $ and take turns w/ the claw. one kid plays the game, and the other two position themselves around the machine and give advice and feedback to the claw operator.

then they end up winning a ton of toys and stuffed animals, way more than if they were doing it alone.

By: Melanie H

Melanie H — Wed, 03 Mar 2010 02:45:39 +0000

Reminds me of one day at a local mexican restaurant my husband won a stuffed animal in one of the claw machines & I gave it to a little girl maybe about 5 years old. Her dad then gave her money to play & she won a stuffed animal & gave it to me. She was so happy & I was so happy for her, I still have that prize in my dining room. Just share their joy of winning :-)

By: bogart

bogart — Wed, 03 Mar 2010 02:44:07 +0000

This post and the comments are great. What a kick. I agree … no need for guilt (or overthinking) on spending fun money. It’s for fun!

All that said, my understanding is that animals that can push a button and get a reward that they receive only sometimes (unpredictable when) are more devoted button-pushers than animals that get a reward every time. Human animals too. Casinos know this and so, I bet, do claw-machine makers. If the kids keep playing and win occasionally, they may enjoy playing this one for a long time.

By: brooke

brooke — Wed, 03 Mar 2010 02:36:58 +0000

I loved the claw machine! It was my absolute favorite machine!! And I loved to scope out which toy I wanted, then figure out which one was the most accessible. I rarely won, but when I did it was so worth it!! I probably donated those toys, but I loved the attempts to get them :-)

By: AJ

AJ — Tue, 02 Mar 2010 21:34:37 +0000

Moby (#17): Depending on how the machine is set where you leave, Deal or No Deal machines can actually be VERY expoitable.

The ones in the town where I live show you what is in each case as soon as you put your money in (presumably to meet some state law requiring it to be a game of skill), and then shuffle the cases really fast in front of you like a game of 16-card monte. If you have a quick eye, you can follow the cases and know where the million is every time.

Me personally? Since I won a little over half of the games I played, I made it a hobby of mine over the last year or so to take everything I could out of this game…over six months or so, I put $100 in to the machine and got out a Sony PSP, a Garmin GPS unit, and $125 worth of gift cards.

So trust me, those machines (or at least the ones with the skill-game involved) are quite beatable.

By: Ryan

Ryan — Tue, 02 Mar 2010 20:04:29 +0000

Great article!

I win stuffed animals from those machines every once in a while. I obviously don’t play for the animal, but for the “excitement”. And when friends say “I bet you won’t win one….” Well…then, it’s game on!

By: Brad

Brad — Tue, 02 Mar 2010 19:22:01 +0000

The sting of failure is a lesson kids these days do not learn and I am glad you are teaching it. When I made bets with my dad, I had to pay him. Later in life I learned he just bought something for me with any of that money without me knowing what (extra video game for christmas or something) but I am finding parents these days refuse to disappoint kids.

By: Amy

Amy — Tue, 02 Mar 2010 17:50:40 +0000

I really enjoyed this article and all the comments. Thanks Trent!

By: Lily

Lily — Tue, 02 Mar 2010 17:12:04 +0000

Agree with Jon #37. No guilt should be put on blowing “fun” money. If you’re gonna be guilty about it, why call it “fun” money? I’m on my way to spend $20 on bingo – and you can bet I won’t be feeling a bit guilty whether I win or lose – it’s being with my friend and enjoying a free cocktail. It’s called entertainment and it doesn’t have to do anything but make me feel good for the moment. As long as I’m not dipping into my “non-fun” $, then I will not be guilty!

By: Kiran

Kiran — Tue, 02 Mar 2010 17:02:04 +0000

My father used to be really good at those machines. I had dozens of stuffed animals, a few of which I really liked. He gets a bit of a gambling fix and for 50 cents (two tries back then) and I get a stuffed toy.

Also this comment thread is great.

By: Catherine

Catherine — Tue, 02 Mar 2010 16:03:33 +0000

Sometimes the value is not just the item received, but the fun in playing the game. I have a friend who will play every crane game that he sees to try and “beat” it. His car is full of stuffed animals as his “trophies”. Once he beats a machine, he doesn’t play it again. I personally don’t see it as a fun thing for me, but to him it is a challenging hobby. I will say I have probably spent more on craft supplies I will never get around to using than he has spent on his crane-game-hobby. To each their own.

By: Tina

Tina — Tue, 02 Mar 2010 16:00:47 +0000

@Rachel – Another voice chiming in to say: Stop giving your kids terrible advice and then whining when they don’t follow it. Wow.

By: Jon

Jon — Tue, 02 Mar 2010 15:52:29 +0000

In the midst of this story, I found another gem, entirely. You said that your son has his money in “four equal parts: money to freely spend, money to save for an item he wants, money for an annual charitable gift, and money for investing for the long term.” Sometimes, we catch some flack, or give ourselves a hard time, about money in the “freely spend” category, about the choices we make with that money. As long as the other categories (plus expenses, for us adults) are taken care of, we should be able to blow our “freely spend” money without guilt on anything that isn’t damaging us or others in some way, right? I need to work on this attitude in my life – sometimes I get way too worried about how I spend my fun money.

By: triLcat

triLcat — Tue, 02 Mar 2010 14:35:29 +0000

@Rachel – taking a mortgage means that you’re giving the bank interest. Frequently you pay more in interest than you would pay in rent, meaning that you’re not even building equity with that money.

If, otoh, you put cash into investments, you can build up that money, and eventually take less mortgage, pay less interest. Particularly if you’re talking about a place where you don’t intend to stay for several years, the idea that renting is throwing away money is simply not true.

Plus, if the whole plumbing system of the house (for example) goes out, the OWNER is responsible, not the renter. I’ve been renting for the past 7 years (2 diff places, got married in there) and simply put, our financial situation is LOADS better than it would be if we had a mortgage on our heads.

We have more than 1/2 the price of a reasonable place in cash right now, but will have a substantial chunk more in about 2 years, so we’re still waiting rather than throw money into the interest-pit of a mortgage.

And another thing – when my son was born with a problem, we knew that we had cash available for specialists and such without taking a home equity loan that would mean paying more interest.

Fortunately, his care has been relatively inexpensive – most of it is covered, and fortunately he’s doing great, but it was good to know we had cash available.

By: Adam

Adam — Tue, 02 Mar 2010 14:30:52 +0000

@19 Rachel, I agree with Brittany. I guess you’ve been living in a vaccuum for the last 3 years, but real estate isn’t always better than renting, especially for people who move often and aren’t ready to settle down yet!! Stop giving your children bad advice.

By: David/yourfinances101

David/yourfinances101 — Tue, 02 Mar 2010 09:58:39 +0000

Yeah,

I think there is some skill involved with those machines.

Who knows maybe it will help them develop hand-eye coordination skills.