Re:Golfing Girl

I work in what pretty much can only be described as a call-center. Most of the people in my dept take home under 25k/year. When I was 25,I bought my own home, two weeks later bought a (used but nice solid Honda Accord) for 10k, and am currently renovating the two most expensive rooms in a house (bathroom and kitchen), using cash. Both are down to the studs. The only debt I currently have is a $60k mortgage that’s 1 year old. I paid the car off in 9 months. Saved 3k efund (and continue to grow it until I get to 7k)and manage to save $500 minimum/month to keep the reno going using cash I have an $800 quartz countertop scheduled to be installed this week, spend $1000 two months back to remodel the detached apartment, $450 went to the bedroom floor, $1300 to the cabinets, $500 new fridge, I dress in outfits sometimes that retail at $100-200. Wear jewelry that retail about the same….and I go to Disney every year, twice a year sometimes. You would probably look at me and make the same assumptions. You wouldn’t have known that before we started working together I worked two jobs and lived at home so I could money to put a sizeable down payment on a house that would make the monthly payments (taxes and insurance included)as little as some folks car payments, leaving me almost half my income left over each month which would allow me to fund a major reno in cash. You wouldn’t know that my mom who has a jewelry and clothing collection that is a little scary works at HSN and gets $200 purses, shoes, or jewelry for $15 – $20. You probably wouldn’t know that I was in showchoir in highschool and as an alum everytime I accept my yearly invite to sing at the Disney Epcot Candlelight show I get two free tickets to any Disney Theme Park. Or that with the FTHB tax credit I paid off my car loan in 9 months, like I planned carefully to. You can’t possibly determine that your coworker’s expenditures don’t “add up” without knowing what they actually are. Do you know your co-worker’s financial history? They could have had a higher paying job before, their spending habits in other areas could be less, they might not have many monthly expenses, there could be other forms of income, investments. They might have bought their McMansion as a foreclosed fixerupper. There are plenty assumptions I can make just going off of your screen name “Golfing Girl”
Golfing is associated with the upper middle (and higher) class. It is notorious for being an expensive sport/hobby/pasttime. The equipment, the rental and ball purchases, possible club dues. Golfing isn’t something I would spend money on, but I wouldn’t assume that you will “come crashing down” if you continue to spend money on it. Any way I kind of rambled, but I was at work and didn’t really have time to fine-tune a comment. Sacrifices!

I dont’ mind recycled posts as a necessary tactic for a high production but frankly this theme is a little tired… and as irritating as ever. But excellent for generating outraged comments!

Regarding the article, I think there are some good ideas to be culled in here but the article wasn’t well organized. The storyline is “Jealousy – and what you can’t see.” That’s a great topic. Using the anecdote he did, he could have crafted a discussion about how making assumptions about someone’s financial situation is always a shot in the dark. Appearances do not always translate into reality. You never know if someone is truly happy and secure, posing, losing their fortune or enduring a non-financial event, (like illness) that makes money and things irrelevant. Jealousies can be curbed by considering one’s own value system: are you willing to be in deep debt to keep up appearances? Are you willing to sacrifice other things you value – time with family, travel, friendships, hobbies, etc – in order to earn more? If the answer to these things is no, then now your own financial life is a matter of choice, and envy – a real emotion – can be better mmanaged.

But the idea in this post, like so many, was not thoughtfully crafted. Even if Trent knows the truth about this family, as his said, he has used this one anecdote to illustrate a hypothesis that all people who look successful fall into two categories: deep in debt or deep in sacrificial misery. He does allow that this is the case for those he has known, and since I don’t know who he has known, perhaps this is true. But his hypothesis then does not take into account other possible scenarios outside of his personal experience.

Trent, you have seeds of good ideas, but they need more organization and your writing more polish. “Now that house that they had sunk so much money into is gone, as is the family.” The house is gone? Torn down? The family isn’t gone, they still exist and are living in an apartment. You’ve made statements that suggest you have intentionally prioritized quantity over quality, but I urge you to reconsider that decision.

Everyone else: You need to understand that what Trent is writing is a simplification of the truth obviously not all people fit perfectly in these two groups but many do…..

If you were the person who saw all the warning signs but didn’t have the balls to speak up (as it seems is the case for Val Finnell) you’d be trying to blame “the system” for your screw up too.

“But nothing was done,” i.e. “I didn’t say anything either.” “They should have done something.” aka “Not MY fault.”

“There were definitely clear indications that Hasan’s loyalties were not with America. There were all sorts of … comments made throughout the year that made me question his loyalty to the United States, but nothing was done, The issue here is that there’s a political correctness climate in the military. They don’t want to say anything because it would be considered questioning somebody’s religious belief, or they’re afraid of an equal opportunity lawsuit. He was a lightning rod. He made his views known and he was very vocal, he had extremely radical jihadist views. They should’ve confronted him — our professors, officers — but they were too concerned about being politically correct.”

And that’s just one of many who spoke out. And yes, that is political correctness at its finest.

No one is disputing that white men commit terrible crimes. That’s a completely separate issue.

Quit trying to sugarcoat the Hasan massacre as simply an issue of the Army being shorthanded. It wasn’t. Stop ignoring evidence and reality.

Again, this is creepy!

That’s not political correctness at its finest.

Being political correct is pointing out that you shouldn’t be nervous of a fellow passenger just because they “look” Muslim. You should give them the benefit of the doubt and understand they are probably a regular person.

Fort Hood was a massive screw up and I don’t think anyone disagrees with that.

However, thanks to sharp eyed police a potentially worse domestic terrorist attack was diverted when CHP officer notices a man in driving erractially and pulled him over. He was heavily armed, wearing body armor and ready to go into the Tides Building and kill as many people as he could.

Two police officers lost their lives, but the shooter was stopped.

He was a white male.

And he’s not the only white native born American male who has been a threat to this country. Or who has tried to kill or actually killed people.

But somehow people bitching about political correctness and how restrictive it is forget about the white Americans who try (and sometimes succeed) at killing people in mass and only talk about being afraid of Muslims doing terrorist and violent acts.

I don’t know what the solution is to the drug war in Mexico, and I *really* don’t want to turn this thread into a debate about immigration policy. I don’t think merely suggesting better immigration enforcement is necessarily racist, but realize that some people (including prominent people like the governor of AZ) are talking quite vocally about the drug war and immigration together in ways that are very, very racist. You’re making your remarks in the context of theirs, and context matters.

I don’t think feeling afraid – or feeling any other emotion – is ever racist. You can’t help what you feel. But when you voice that fear without making it clear that you know it’s based on an untrue racial stereotype (that all Middle Eastern men, or even a significant fraction of Middle Eastern men, are terrorists), then you’re reinforcing that stereotype. And that harms people of Middle Eastern descent.

I vehemently disagree with your comment that being called a racist is anything at all like being the actual victim of racism. You seem to have a good sense of what kinds of things you say trigger accusations of racism. You can choose not to say those things. Not necessarily saying you should, just that you can – it’s within your power. If a person of Mexican or Middle Eastern descent gets tired of people making assumptions about him based on his race, he doesn’t get to choose to stop being Mexican or Middle Eastern for a while – he’s stuck with his race, all the time. That’s a big difference.

And yeah, it is creepy that you seem much more upset about my supposed racist views that you do about a horrible mass murder.

Defend away, I’m waiting…I’ve been begging you, actually. Oh, and while you’re at it, please explain how I’m trying to establish victomhood for a mass murderer. I didn’t call you a bad person, I called you a racist.

Time for a 101st goal: Stop being creepy.

P.S. We’ll see if I get booted off for saying that about you. Is it going to be okay for you to call me a racist but not for me to defend myself?

Julie, I think it is a good first step to admit your fears and uncertainty. Admitting that allows you to take the next step towards understanding and I hope you will. My problem isn’t with intelligent discourse about tough subjects. It’s when someone makes a statement that is racist and then tries to deny that it is, in fact, racist (or, at least intolerant or bigoted). Own your words and your feelings.

I think to a certain degree our prejudices are simply fear and a lack of knowledge about different races, religions and cultures manifested into fear. Sure, there are people out there who hate simply because of skin color or religion but (hopefully) these people are in the minority.

I can’t speak for the politically correct people you know because I’m not one of them but I also don’t think we need to be making blanket statements about people of another race, religion or sexual orientation (or anything else) based on the actions of a small subset of people. Islam is one of the largest world religions there is…surely the actions of a few don’t represent the masses. There are nutbags from every race, religion, region, country…that says nothing about anything except themselves.