I think if everyone else wears jeans and t-shirt, this lady’s husband is already doing the perfect thing. Slacks and polo still says “casual” but also “I take pride in my attention to details, so you can trust me with your work”.

Note: I wear a suit most days, ramping up and down the formality based on the client and venue. And when I first started, I dressed closer to my managers than my peers, and it totally worked. So the dad is not out of touch, he’s just talking about a different work culture.

Then, there is the “I can’t tell the difference between department store quality and designer quality”. Just because you can’t doesn’t mean no one can. That doesn’t mean you have to spend a fortune, but nicer clothes fit better and last longer. We dropped $700 on a new, nicer “grown up” wardrobe for my husband several years ago and haven’t had to replace any of the items since (swapped out his Element and Volcom hoodies for Calvin Klein and Banana Republic slacks and button-downs. At the outlet stores of, course.) Personally, I would rather have 3 nice shirts than 30 ill-fitting cheaper shirts.

Also, just because you don’t *think* he would want to be in management in the future doesn’t mean he won’t. Plans change. Without going overboard, wouldn’t it be safer to dress on the nicer side of casual?

IDK…I agree that engineers aren’t required to wear ties, but OTOH people pay good money to get career advice from older, more experienced folk, and you’re getting it for free. I would take what you can out of it, thank him for his candor, and do what you think is best. If you act offended though, and look the gift-horse in the mouth, he may not offer any to you in the future, which would be a shame.

>>I told her she didn’t give me advice, she gave orders. . .though I tried to sift the relevant intent and meaning from them, and she was constantly exasperated that I didn’t “do as I was told”.<<

Yup. Sounds familiar. I don't know if the father in the original question expects immediate compliance, but it hit one of *my* nerves – LOL!

Too many well meaning individuals figure that what worked for them must absolutely work for you, if only you would do exactly what they did. The father’s point is right in essence as Trent better points out in the article. But the father is potentially off the mark in details. I would recommend that husband simply reply to his father that he is dressing for the promotion, and remind the father that if he out dresses his own boss he’ll potentially harm his chances to be advanced.

Still, I have to say that I relate most to the FIL in this one. I know a lot of engineers and tech guys and they always seem sloppy and fashion-impaired to me – even on dates and at church and at cocktail parties. Now that it’s ok to wear sneakers to work in some industries, there is a whole demographic of men who don’t even own anything suitable even for a funeral or steakhouse or job interview.

And BTW there can be a whole world of difference between cheap khakis and a “polo” and a fashionable pair of well-fitted slacks and a tailored shirt with appropriate belt, shoes, etc.

It’s certainly not a wife/father in law conversation either way.

Wait, what? Why are a grown man’s career ambitions (or lack thereof) his father’s business but not his wife’s?

It seems to me like the father is being a concern troll, and should be handled like any other concern troll: Thank him for his advice, then ignore it.

I was thinking this was an issue between the wife and the husband and the dad should stay out of it.

Does the husband want to move up in the company or not (I can’t really tell.) If not, that’s a convo between the husband and his dad and the letter writer should stay out of it.

Generally for most high tech companies where engineers tend to work, the standard dress of business casual is perfectly fine. IN fact as a fairly accurate generalization I’d say that most engineers have little dress sense and couldn’t tell the difference from a $1000 suit and a $100 suit. Most of us don’t care much at all about clothes. I’ve seen engineers wear sweat pants and t-shirts with cartoon characters.

In fact wearing a tie may backfire. I work in high tech at one of the fortune 100 companies. Nobody in engineering wears a tie to work… ever. WE used to make fun of a guy who wore a tie to work. Your father in laws advice may be completely wrong. Sales people and executives are a different story, they do tend to dress fancier. But even the CEO of our company doesn’t wear ties every day. (I googled his name and foudn 3 pictures without a tie)

But it depends on the company.. if your husband works for a bank or financial company for example then the standard for work dress may be much higher. I’ve known high tech companies (very few) where people do wear ties and suits. I’ve heard IBM is fancier in the dress too but I’m not sure on that.

It depends…

What does your husbands boss wear? That should be fairly obvious demonstration of what attire is required to be a manager.

Now of course if your husband doesn’t want a fancy promotion then he shouldn’t care in any case. BUT he’s getting pressure from his father in law so has to respond to that somehow. If he works in a workplace where dress is casual (high tech) then his dad is wrong. It ain’t 1960 anymore.

Programmers typically dress down, as they’re not meeting with the public. It sounds to me Marjorie’s husband is already dressing one level above his cohorts, so I’d just thank dad for the comments and do what makes your husband most comfortable. And, Maggie, I disagree that managers consider the brand you wear, unless, again, you’re in high end retail or other rarified environments.

The only point still unaddressed, in what came forward for me, is the writer saying they “can’t tell the difference between the cheaper JCPenney brands and the nicer department store brands”. Unfortunately, the people who make hiring decisions at the top CAN tell the difference, and some of them use that difference (consciously or not) to help them make hiring decisions.

If at any point the programmer does want to move into management, or if he wants to be hired at an unfamiliar organization, it might be useful for them to learn to recognize the subtle differences in fabric, cut, and detailing that the senior management folks will notice.

(And, full disclosure, this advice could be 25 years out of date, based on my advanced age).

Thanks so much for the wonderfully clear writing you put out here for us.